<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
	xmlns:georss="http://www.georss.org/georss" xmlns:geo="http://www.w3.org/2003/01/geo/wgs84_pos#" xmlns:media="http://search.yahoo.com/mrss/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Plot Hole</title>
	<atom:link href="http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/</link>
	<description>A Medley of Extemporanea</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 07 Dec 2009 05:11:11 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.com/</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: foeb</title>
		<link>http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-70</link>
		<dc:creator>foeb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Sep 2007 03:53:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-70</guid>
		<description>No. I can tell. &lt;i&gt;Blow Out&lt;/i&gt; is more your speed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No. I can tell. <i>Blow Out</i> is more your speed.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: matt w</title>
		<link>http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-68</link>
		<dc:creator>matt w</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Sep 2007 00:40:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-68</guid>
		<description>I wasn&#039;t that into &lt;i&gt;Blow Up&lt;/i&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wasn&#8217;t that into <i>Blow Up</i>.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: foeb</title>
		<link>http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-67</link>
		<dc:creator>foeb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Sep 2007 00:23:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-67</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Blow Up&lt;/i&gt; is better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Blow Up</i> is better.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: The Modesto Kid</title>
		<link>http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-66</link>
		<dc:creator>The Modesto Kid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Sep 2007 22:15:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-66</guid>
		<description>Directed at my 11 or at matt&#039;s 8? Because looking at its description on IMDB it sounds like something I would like and indeed to have things in common with &lt;em&gt;Rear Window&lt;/em&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Directed at my 11 or at matt&#8217;s 8? Because looking at its description on IMDB it sounds like something I would like and indeed to have things in common with <em>Rear Window</em>.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: ben wolfson</title>
		<link>http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-65</link>
		<dc:creator>ben wolfson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 29 Sep 2007 17:43:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-65</guid>
		<description>You should really see &lt;em&gt;The Conversation&lt;/em&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You should really see <em>The Conversation</em>.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: The Modesto Kid</title>
		<link>http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-57</link>
		<dc:creator>The Modesto Kid</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 13:06:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-57</guid>
		<description>I was really happy the most recent time I watched &lt;em&gt;Rear Window&lt;/em&gt;, that it had been long enough since the previous time I had watched it for me to forget what happens at the end. The experience of watching a great movie is distinct from the experience of being held in suspense waiting to find out what happens, thinking you&#039;ve got it figured out, getting your expectations inverted -- but certainly both are nice experiences. If you can have them both together, well, all to the better.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was really happy the most recent time I watched <em>Rear Window</em>, that it had been long enough since the previous time I had watched it for me to forget what happens at the end. The experience of watching a great movie is distinct from the experience of being held in suspense waiting to find out what happens, thinking you&#8217;ve got it figured out, getting your expectations inverted &#8212; but certainly both are nice experiences. If you can have them both together, well, all to the better.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: matt w</title>
		<link>http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-56</link>
		<dc:creator>matt w</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 00:52:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-56</guid>
		<description>I assume you&#039;re joking with breast-beating. I mean, if you could figure out the plot twist without even seeing the movie, that&#039;s not your fault.

Charles Schulz spoiled &quot;Rosebud&quot; for me -- Linus is watching Citizen Kane, which he&#039;s never seen before, and as Lucy&#039;s walking away she says &quot;Rosebud was his


SPOILER

sled.&quot; At the time I was like, &quot;Why is that funny?&quot; Eventually I realized that it was because Lucy had given away the mystery, and I was annoyed. Though one of my colleagues says that anything that&#039;s worth reading/watching should be worth reading/watching even after you know the spoiler -- which is I think true, but knowing spoilers can be bad.

Still, as someone said about &lt;i&gt;The Sixth Sense&lt;/i&gt;, &quot;You watch it once for the surprise, then a second time to see how they set up the surprise, then a third time to realize it stinks.&quot; I said that I&#039;d had it spoiled but that I figured that just meant I could watch it the first time for the second time, and he said, &quot;Yeah, that&#039;s two hours saved from your life.&quot; 

Ben, what you&#039;re describing seems related to, but different from, the Problem/Law of Crappy Sequels discussed &lt;a href=&quot;http://mattweiner.net/blog/archives/000111.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt; and &lt;a href=&quot;http://mattweiner.net/blog/archives/000363.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;; more like the &lt;a href=&quot;http://mattweiner.net/blog/archives/000346.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Larry David time travel problem&lt;/a&gt;. 

I&#039;m not actually sure that late U2 is any more pompous than early U2. Isn&#039;t &lt;i&gt;Achtung Baby!&lt;/i&gt; their &lt;i&gt;least&lt;/i&gt; pompous album?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I assume you&#8217;re joking with breast-beating. I mean, if you could figure out the plot twist without even seeing the movie, that&#8217;s not your fault.</p>
<p>Charles Schulz spoiled &#8220;Rosebud&#8221; for me &#8212; Linus is watching Citizen Kane, which he&#8217;s never seen before, and as Lucy&#8217;s walking away she says &#8220;Rosebud was his</p>
<p>SPOILER</p>
<p>sled.&#8221; At the time I was like, &#8220;Why is that funny?&#8221; Eventually I realized that it was because Lucy had given away the mystery, and I was annoyed. Though one of my colleagues says that anything that&#8217;s worth reading/watching should be worth reading/watching even after you know the spoiler &#8212; which is I think true, but knowing spoilers can be bad.</p>
<p>Still, as someone said about <i>The Sixth Sense</i>, &#8220;You watch it once for the surprise, then a second time to see how they set up the surprise, then a third time to realize it stinks.&#8221; I said that I&#8217;d had it spoiled but that I figured that just meant I could watch it the first time for the second time, and he said, &#8220;Yeah, that&#8217;s two hours saved from your life.&#8221; </p>
<p>Ben, what you&#8217;re describing seems related to, but different from, the Problem/Law of Crappy Sequels discussed <a href="http://mattweiner.net/blog/archives/000111.html" rel="nofollow">here</a> and <a href="http://mattweiner.net/blog/archives/000363.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>; more like the <a href="http://mattweiner.net/blog/archives/000346.html" rel="nofollow">Larry David time travel problem</a>. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m not actually sure that late U2 is any more pompous than early U2. Isn&#8217;t <i>Achtung Baby!</i> their <i>least</i> pompous album?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Matt's mom</title>
		<link>http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-55</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt's mom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Sep 2007 00:34:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-55</guid>
		<description>Re 7: mea spoila, mea spoila, mea maxima spoila! (beats breast)
As for the statute of limitations, I always feel that people shouldn&#039;t casually reveal the identity of &quot;Rosebud&quot;--but that&#039;s me. Somebody said, &quot;Time is God&#039;s way of preventing everything from happening at once,&quot; but now everything IS happening at once: reruns, prequels, retro fashion...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re 7: mea spoila, mea spoila, mea maxima spoila! (beats breast)<br />
As for the statute of limitations, I always feel that people shouldn&#8217;t casually reveal the identity of &#8220;Rosebud&#8221;&#8211;but that&#8217;s me. Somebody said, &#8220;Time is God&#8217;s way of preventing everything from happening at once,&#8221; but now everything IS happening at once: reruns, prequels, retro fashion&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ben</title>
		<link>http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-54</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Sep 2007 02:24:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-54</guid>
		<description>It doesn&#039;t matter what George Lucas&#039;s intent is.  It matters what the community of Star Wars fanatics thinks the right order is.  They can decide what is canonical.  (You probably know this: in the Star Trek and Star Wars universes/franchises, there is an entire body of scholarship built up around constructing an internally consistent &quot;canon&quot; and explaining away inconsistent timelines or plot developments, or just throwing them down the memory hole.)

It&#039;s only a matter of time before the fans manage to evade Lucas&#039;s copyright police and produce recut versions to suit their own tastes and orthodoxies (this has already been done to eliminate the annoying Jamaican guy, I believe).

The Star Wars prequels are perhaps the best example of my theory of retroreader response criticism, or retrospective cultural market correction.  An artist&#039;s subsequent creations actually influence his or her previous work. While that may seem like a timeline violation, it is not in the framework of reader response theory.  The later Star Wars movies, for many people (I haven&#039;t seen them, but I heard the complaints!  And even the trailers were pretty yuck) disappoint expectations raised by the &quot;classic&quot; movies (original canon).  I am claiming, further, that the prequel movies actually amplify and extend hackish tendencies in the originals, and that the originals are permanently devalued because one can no longer write off their not lovably-cheesy, but just bad-cheesy, aspects.

There are plenty of other examples.  For ex, the breakout novels of Jay McInerney and Bret Easton Ellis, devalued by their later work.  Late U2 reminds you that even early U2 was, ya know, a little pompous.  This is not just the common fact that an artist&#039;s work just goes downhill or fails to recapture later heights.  Everybody thinks F. Scott Fitzgerald&#039;s late work doesn&#039;t reach the heights of Gatsby, but nobody seriously reads the late books and decides that Gatsby is just warmed-over John O&#039;Hara.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It doesn&#8217;t matter what George Lucas&#8217;s intent is.  It matters what the community of Star Wars fanatics thinks the right order is.  They can decide what is canonical.  (You probably know this: in the Star Trek and Star Wars universes/franchises, there is an entire body of scholarship built up around constructing an internally consistent &#8220;canon&#8221; and explaining away inconsistent timelines or plot developments, or just throwing them down the memory hole.)</p>
<p>It&#8217;s only a matter of time before the fans manage to evade Lucas&#8217;s copyright police and produce recut versions to suit their own tastes and orthodoxies (this has already been done to eliminate the annoying Jamaican guy, I believe).</p>
<p>The Star Wars prequels are perhaps the best example of my theory of retroreader response criticism, or retrospective cultural market correction.  An artist&#8217;s subsequent creations actually influence his or her previous work. While that may seem like a timeline violation, it is not in the framework of reader response theory.  The later Star Wars movies, for many people (I haven&#8217;t seen them, but I heard the complaints!  And even the trailers were pretty yuck) disappoint expectations raised by the &#8220;classic&#8221; movies (original canon).  I am claiming, further, that the prequel movies actually amplify and extend hackish tendencies in the originals, and that the originals are permanently devalued because one can no longer write off their not lovably-cheesy, but just bad-cheesy, aspects.</p>
<p>There are plenty of other examples.  For ex, the breakout novels of Jay McInerney and Bret Easton Ellis, devalued by their later work.  Late U2 reminds you that even early U2 was, ya know, a little pompous.  This is not just the common fact that an artist&#8217;s work just goes downhill or fails to recapture later heights.  Everybody thinks F. Scott Fitzgerald&#8217;s late work doesn&#8217;t reach the heights of Gatsby, but nobody seriously reads the late books and decides that Gatsby is just warmed-over John O&#8217;Hara.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: matt w</title>
		<link>http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-53</link>
		<dc:creator>matt w</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Sep 2007 19:03:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://saucersofmud.wordpress.com/2007/09/13/plot-hole/#comment-53</guid>
		<description>Though in fact I&#039;ve never seen &lt;i&gt;The Conversation&lt;/i&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Though in fact I&#8217;ve never seen <i>The Conversation</i>.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
